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Below are the 3 most recent journal entries recorded in Ex-Mormon, In-active LDS interaction Community.'s LiveJournal:

Friday, October 7th, 2005
12:51 am
[fur_immer_sunde]
Any Christians in here? Here's some Biblical passages that disprove Mormon (LDS) beliefs...
Finding things that disprove LDS beliefs makes me REALLY happy. ^_^

I was doing some scripture study and I stumbled upon quite a few Bible passages that obviously disprove Mormon beliefs.

There Was No "Apostacy" of Christ's Church

First, Jesus Christ told the Apostles that he would always be with them and the church. So for Mormons (LDS) to say there was an apostacy in the church is basically them saying that Jesus Christ was a liar. Here is the scripture reference:

MATTHEW 16:18 18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it

Now if the "gates of hell shall not prevail against it (the Church)" then how could there have possibly of been an apostacy... the only way there could be is if when speaking these words Jesus Christ was lying. And to call Christ a liar is blasphemy.

Apostate (EX) Mormons Will Not Be Sent to "Outer Darkness"

I also found a scriptural reference to what Mormons say about Apostate Mormons (EX-Mormons). LDS say that ex-LDS will be sent to the "outer darkness" (be abandoned by God and seperated from him) when they die, check out what the Bible has to say about that:

John 12:46 46I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.

The keyword here is whosoever. "WHOSOEVER believeth on me should not abide in darkness"... Christ, God, Our Father, will NOT abandon anyone who believes in God, anyone that believes in Jesus as the savior. So LDS claim that ex-LDS will be abandoned and seperated by God is completely false!


The Trinity - Not Three Seperate Individuals

Mormons (LDS) believe that the Father, the Son (Christ), and the Holy Spirit are three seperate entities when indeed they are not. Biblical proof of this is:

1st John 5:7 7For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one

John 12:44-45 44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me. 45And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me
Thursday, January 20th, 2005
4:39 pm
[ctrtc]
Oh come ON!!....'refer back to the previous post'. Talk about giving an uncertain sound, Your the man in charge of and responsible for 'changing what your predecessor says was not changeable', quoted correctly, saying, that the things of God are unchangeable...,'I am GOD I change NOT'.

And what do you do...give an uncertain sound on the trumpet..., snap to it...your slipping. Signs of BAD 'poor' leadership!


Quotes from his book say one thing 'Teachings' Hinkley...., his actions say another: He is right in one thing 'in this kingdom'...for Christ said, 'my kingdom is not of this world'. His kingdom is NOT here...but the LDS 'mormon' one, as quoted by Hinkley, IS.

You cant mix your doctrine's with God and Christ's,...it wont work. So who ya following there guy, and why are you leading so many astray with you...,'in contradiction of the Christ'? Get yourself congruent 'lined up' with GOD and quick. Something sure IS wrong...sound the trumpet indeed'!!!



Teachings of Hinckley: Leadership
In your ministry as leaders in this Church, brethren [and sisters], bless the people. Lift them. Encourage them. Help them. There are so many in distress. They have so many troubles, so many problems....We receive thousands of letters in the Office of the First Presidency from people who live all over this world, in spite of all of our efforts to get them to see their bishops instead of writing to the First Presidency. But they have problems, many of them, and they need help, and they need encouragement, and they need listening to, and that's our great opportunity to bless them.

Bless them with leadership. "For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?" (1 Cor. 14:8). Yours is the opportunity to blow the trumpet with a certain sound. You are leaders. Every man [and woman] here is a leader because you are responsible for the well-being of others. That makes of you a leader. Lead the people. Lead them with boldness. Lead them with faith. Get on your knees and pray to the Lord and lead the people with faith. They will follow where you go as their leaders. God bless you in so doing.

Lead them with doctrine. "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life; and they are they which testify of me" (John 5:39). Teach out of the word of God the doctrine of the kingdom which will save them and bless them and help them and lift them. Teach them the scriptures. Lead them with the scriptures.

Bless them with responsibility. Give them something to do. ...I talked the other day with a man who's been in the stake presidency, who's been in the bishopric, who presided over a mission, who's been a regional representative, and he doesn't have a thing to do, except to sit home with his sick wife and nurse and tend her. He is almost destroyed because he has nothing to reach out to, no responsibility in this kingdom. Bless them with responsibility, brethern. They long for it. They hunger for it, and then need it.

Bless them with example. My father used to say that "more religion is caught that is taught." I believe that. This is a contagious thing... Teach them with example. Let your example be such that they can follow it. Brethren [and sisters], there's no place in your lives, there is no place in your lives for any element of infidelity or immorality, or the reading of pornography, or anything of that kind. You just cannot afford to touch it....

Treat your wives [and husbands] with kindness. You will never have a greater asset in all of this world than the woman [or man] with whom you joined hands over the alter in the temple and to whom you pledged your love and loyalty and devotion for time and all eternity....Be an example to your people of those who walk the path of faith. God bless you as leaders to set an example before your people.

Bless those you lead. May their lives be richer for their experience with you under your leadership. I am so grateful, as I look back, at the privilege that has been mine to work with great men since I was a very young man, even when I was on a mission. My mission president was a member of the Council of the Twelve, a great and good man, and ever since then, it has been my privilege to work with great men who have blessed my life in a very real sense. I am here today because of the munificent effect that others have had upon my life I know that. I've been blessed, and as long as I live, I'd like to bless the lives of others.
(Potomac Virginia Regional Conference, priesthood leadership session, April 26, 1997.)
1:32 am
[kingdoublethink]
...hmmm, look what I ran into:
I found this article:
This complicates a few things and is puzzling. Changes happening where changes are NOT allowed to happen? You people are breaking your own rules...or supposedly God's rules and statement...., that he NEVER changes. 'Ye shall know them by their fruit', thats some mighty obvious rotten looking fruit. Can an LDS person explain to me how this is possible?


Can sacred temple covenants and ordinances be changed?


Here's a recent quote from the church's Ensign Magazine:

From August 2001 Ensign (page 22), in big bold print above a large colorful portrait of Joseph Smith:

"The Prophet Joseph Smith taught, 'Ordinances instituted in the heavens before the foundation of the world, in the priesthood, for the salvation of men, are not to be altered or changed.'"

This is from an article specifically on the temple ordinances. The author of the article is a General Authority, so he must know that the temple ordinances have gone through major revisions - including deletions of covenants, teachings and ordinances - over the last 160 years.

To back up the Joseph Smith quote used in the August 2001 issue of the Ensign Magazine:

"No jot, iota, or tittle of the temple rites is otherwise than uplifting and sanctifying. In every detail the endowment ceremony contributes to covenants of morality of life, consecration of person to high ideals, devotion to truth, patriotism to nation, and allegiance to God."
- Apostle James E. Talmage, The House of the Lord, 1968, p. 84

"Now the purpose in Himself in the winding up scene of the last dispensation is that all things pertaining to that dispensation should be conducted precisely in accordance with the preceding dispensations.... He set the temple ordinances to be the same forever and ever and set Adam to watch over them, to reveal them from heaven to man, or to send angels to reveal them."
- Joseph Smith, History of the Church, vol.4, p. 208

"As temple work progresses, some members wonder if the ordinances can be changed or adjusted. These ordinances have been provided by revelation, and are in the hands of the First Presidency. Thus, the temple is protected from tampering."
- W. Grant Bangerter, executive director of the Temple Department and a member of the First Quorum of Seventy, Deseret News, Church Section, January 16, 1982

"...God is unchangeable, the same yesterday, today and forever... The great mistake made down through the ages by teachers of Christianity, is that they have supposed they could place their own private interpretation upon scriptures, allow their own personal convenience to become a controlling factor, and change the basis of Christian law and practice to suit themselves. This is apostasy."
- Prophet's Message, Church News, June 5, 1965

"...the endowments have never changed and can never change; as I understand it; it has been so testified, and that Joseph Smith Jr., himself was the founder of the endowments."
- Senator Reed Smoot, Reed Smoot Case, vol. 3, p. 185

"...build a house to my name, for the Most High to dwell therein. For there is not a place found on earth that he may come to and restore again that which was lost unto you, or which he hath taken away, even the fullness of the priesthood.... And verily I say unto you, let this house be built unto my name, that I may reveal mine ordinances therein... For I deign to reveal unto my church things which have been kept hid from before the foundation of the world, things that pertain to the dispensation of the fullness of times. And I will show unto my servant Joseph all things pertaining to this house, and the priesthood thereof, and the place whereon it shall be built."
- Jesus Christ Himself, Doctrine and Covenants 124:27-28, 40-42

"The Gospel can not possibly be changed.... the saving principles must ever be the same. They can never change.... the Gospel must always be the same in all of its parts.... no one can change the Gospel... if they attempt to do so, they only set up a man-made system which is not the Gospel, but is merely a reflection of their own views.... if we substitute 'any other Gospel,' there is no salvation in it.... the Lord and His Gospel remain the same--always."
- Prophet's Message, Church News, June 5, 1965

Here's the Paradox:

The temple sealing ceremony (which is required for salvation) itself has gone through major changes over the years. so have the very covenants in the temple. In fact, the ordinances and teachings in the temple endowment ceremony went through a significant change as recently as April 1990!

See: http://helpingmormons.org/Altered.htm

If these were divinely restored in their complete form from "the foundation of the world" then why have they kept changing? And if Smith says they can never be altered OR changed, how come the Church did it? Who got it wrong, the prophet Smith or his only true Church? Either way, it smells like a hoax.

Don't take my word for it. Here' a comprehensive list of all the changes in the temple covenants, ceremonies and ordinances made in April 1990:

http://helpingmormons.org/compare.htm

Don't fall for the excuse that the ceremony is just a vehicle for the ordinance. If it's just a vehicle, then what IS the ordinance? If it includes the covenants, oaths, handshakes, signs, keywords or even words at the veil, then they have changed significantly over the years.

We're not talking about a blessing or a prayer that can be changed. We're talking about revealed temple ordinances that are suposed to be free from the tainting of men.

The words in the temple ordinances are just as revealed and un-alterable as the words in the sacrament prayer. The ordinance of sealing must be said correctly, just like the temple endowment ceremony or it's not valid. Every believing Mormon knows the reason for this is that they are revealed as the saving ordinances that can't change. Christ in the Book of Mormon taught this very principle when he gave the Nephites the exact same words used today for the sacrament. The temple ordinances are no different.

What about those poor young Priests in Sacrament Meeting who happen to say a word wrong in the sacrament prayer? Why embarrass them and make them say it exactly right if the words are just a "vehicle?" If the sacrament ordinance can't change, then why can the temple ordinances change?
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